<ul class="summary-list"><li>Elfman rushed to the airplane bathroom to record ideas he had for the"<keyword id="25718" type="PERSON" weightage="60" keywordseo="batman">Batman</keyword>" score.</li><li>He went so often that the flight attendants took notice.</li><li>"They were probably going, 'What the f--- he is doing so frequently?'" Elfman told Marc Maron.</li></ul><p>One of the most memorable pieces of <keyword id="6354530" type="CITY" weightage="60" keywordseo="music">music</keyword> created by Oscar-nominated composer <keyword id="499432" type="PERSON" weightage="60" keywordseo="Danny-Elfman">Danny Elfman</keyword> is the score from <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRZAk2rfESU">Tim Burton's 1989 classic "Batman."</a></p><p>Elfman revealed on a recent episode of the <a href="http://www.wtfpod.com/podcast/episode-1232-danny-elfman">"WTF with Marc Maron" podcast</a> that the genesis for the score came to him while taking one of his many trips home from the "Batman" set in London.</p><p>"That hit me at the worst possible time," Elfman recalled to Maron. "On the way home, the [score] f---ing hits me. And it was like, what do I do? I'm on a 747. How do I do this? I am going to forget this all. I'm going to land and they're going to play some f---ing Beatles song, and I'm going to forget everything."</p><p>So scared his ideas would slip his mind before landing back in Los Angeles, Elfman rushed to the airplane bathroom and using the recorder he always kept with him to capture ideas that would come to him, began recording what would become the "Batman" score.</p><p>But Elfman says he continued to go to the bathroom to record ideas, as he didn't want the person sitting next to him to hear what he was doing.</p><div type="image" title="Danny Elfman" height="683" width="911" msid="83342463" hostid="261"></div><p>"I start running in the bathroom, and I go back to my seat," Elfman said. "Ten minutes later, back in the bathroom. And then back to my seat and then back to the bathroom."</p><p>Elfman said it got to a point where the flight attendants on the plane began to take notice.</p><p>"Ten minutes later, I am back in the bathroom," he said. "And I open the door and this time there are three flight attendants. They were probably going, 'What the f--- he is doing so frequently?'"</p><p>The music Elfman originated in that bathroom would go on to become one of the most memorable elements of the Tim Burton-era "Batman" <keyword id="406" type="ENTERTAINMENT" weightage="60" keywordseo="Movies">movies</keyword>, which starred <a href="https://www.insider.com/batman-actors-ranked-best-worst-2020-6">Michael Keaton in the Dark Knight role</a>.</p><p>The score also went on to win a Grammy.</p><p>Elfman's other works include Oscar-nominated scores for movies like "Milk," "Good Will Hunting," "Men in Black," and "Big Fish." He will next be doing music for Sam Raimi's "Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness."</p>

Danny Elfman recalls baffling flight attendants when composing the iconic 'Batman' theme tune in an airplane bathroom

<ul class="summary-list"><li>Content creator E.V. Rogina posted a TikTok video showing the gothic nursery designed for her twins.</li><li>Speaking with Insider, she explained how she and her wife created the space and why they love it.</li></ul><p>Gothic decor isn't just for adults — it can be for infants too.</p><p>For proof, look no further than the dark, slightly spooky nursery created by lifestyle content creator <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@evdreadful" target="_blank" rel="noopener">E.V. Rogina</a>, who goes by E.V. Dreadful online, and her wife <a href="https://www.instagram.com/mdv1216/" target="_blank" rel="noopener">Monica Ventura</a>.</p><p>The Orlando, Florida, couple recently posted <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@evdreadful/video/7267282975937531182" target="_blank" rel="noopener">a TikTok to Rogina's page</a> showing the step-by-step process of merging gray walls, black furniture, ghost-shaped pillows, and more to create their ideal nursery for their 11-week-old twins.</p><p>Their video, which was posted on Tuesday, has since been viewed more than 41 million times.</p><blockquote class="tiktok-embed" cite="https://www.tiktok.com/@evdreadful/video/7267282975937531182" data-video-id="7267282975937531182" style="max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px;"> <section> <a target="_blank" title="@evdreadful" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@evdreadful?refer=embed">@evdreadful</a> Our sad gray  baby nursery ☠️ <a title="growingourcoven" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/growingourcoven?refer=embed">#growingourcoven</a> <a title="babybats" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/babybats?refer=embed">#babybats</a> <a title="spookymom" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/spookymom?refer=embed">#spookymom</a> <a title="gothicnursery" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/gothicnursery?refer=embed">#gothicnursery</a> <a title="gothinterior" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/gothinterior?refer=embed">#gothinterior</a> <a title="homedecor" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/homedecor?refer=embed">#homedecor</a> <a title="vlog" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/vlog?refer=embed">#vlog</a> <a title="twins" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/twins?refer=embed">#twins</a> <a title="alt" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/alt?refer=embed">#alt</a> <a title="witchtok" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/witchtok?refer=embed">#witchtok</a> <a title="newborn" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/newborn?refer=embed">#newborn</a> <a title="gothbaby" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/gothbaby?refer=embed">#gothbaby</a> <a title="fyp" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/fyp?refer=embed">#fyp</a> <a target="_blank" title="♬ Wednesday Main Titles (Single from Wednesday Original Series Soundtrack) - Danny Elfman" href="https://www.tiktok.com/music/Wednesday-Main-Titles-Single-from-Wednesday-Original-Series-Soundtrack-7167070905368053761?refer=embed">♬ Wednesday Main Titles (Single from Wednesday Original Series Soundtrack) - Danny Elfman</a> </section> </blockquote> <p>Rogina told Insider that she and her wife wanted to mix gothic and modern elements in the nursery to match both of their decor preferences.</p><p>"I'm very much into gothic and Victorian design, and of course, my wife is the complete opposite," Rogina said with a laugh. "She loves minimal and modern, so we try to do every home project with the intention of merging those styles."</p><p>Color was another big element of the planning process, Rogina said. Their home currently includes a forest-green office, a red library-esque bathroom, and other themed spaces.</p><p>"The nursery design started with me researching colors," she said. "Looking at gray, I found that it's considered to be an extremely calming color for babies. When I think of myself growing up, I was always overstimulated. And even as an adult, the world can be so much. So I was like, let's build a little room that they can always come back to and find peace."</p><div type="image" title="The gothic nursery created by E.V. Rogina and her wife." height="1584" width="1059" msid="102841710" hostid="261"></div><p>Rogina discovered she was pregnant in October 2022, started designing the nursery in January 2023, and worked on it until she was put on bed rest in April and gave birth in May.</p><p>While the room is "a little bit incomplete," she said, the heart of the room and symbols of their family are there.</p><p>"We have ghosties throughout our whole home, so there are ghost plushies that are more childish and appeal to them," she said. "And I have a whole bunch of bat stuff downstairs, so I was like, 'Let's find cute bat things for them.' It's kind of how they'll get to know us — by showing them these things and who their parents are and the world they're born into."</p><div type="image" title="Inside the gothic nursery created by E.V. Rogina and her wife." height="900" width="1200" msid="102841712" hostid="261"></div><p>Another standout piece in the room is a mobile with small bats hanging from it in a swirled shape — creating the illusion that they're flying.</p><p>Rogina said she had been "searching, searching, searching" for the perfect mobile for the room, and couldn't find anything that worked. But as luck would have it, a friend of the couple did.</p><p>"She said we would get a box in front of our home," Rogina said. "I opened it and was like, 'Finally! The perfect mobile!' And I didn't have to do the work."</p><div type="image" title="Inside the gothic nursery created by E.V. Rogina and her wife." height="1616" width="1080" msid="102841714" hostid="261"></div><p>While there have been some critics of the unique nursery the couple created, Rogina said she's not too worried. Instead, she's been laughing.</p><p>"We're a lesbian couple. I'm a gay mom. Babies are not accidental, they're planned. So everything we did for them was planned," she said. "I know they need color, so there's a corner in the room with a big basket full of colorful toys. Their books are extremely colorful."</p><p>"As a creator, you show what you want people to see," she continued. "But we take the babies outside. We go to places like museums and aquariums."</p><p>Rogina said she's also been accused of "pushing the gothic agenda" on her babies.</p><p>"What about a mom who chooses a pink room, or a blue room, or a safari room?" she said. "I have boy and girl twins who have to share a room, so I don't wanna pick a color for them. They can share it and it'll feel fair to the both of them until they're old enough to have their own rooms. And then they can go haywire, and do whatever they want to their rooms."</p><div type="image" title="A bookshelf created by E.V. Rogina for her twins' nursery." height="809" width="1079" msid="102841716" hostid="261"></div><p>Rogina knows that gothic decor might not be for everybody. It might not even be for her children. But in her opinion, that's the beauty of it.</p><p>"Right now, it's for us. The nursery is nice, it's beautiful, it's calming," she said. "But one day, the babies are going to have an opinion. And I'm going to go with it and support whatever it is that they want to do. That's what a parent's job is."</p>

A couple transformed their twins' room into a gothic nursery complete with gray walls, ghost pillows, and a bat chandelier

<ul class="summary-list"><li>Warning: Mild spoilers ahead for "The Flash."</li><li>The Andy Muschietti-directed superhero movie has been overhyped by early critics.</li></ul><p>Early critics heralded "The Flash" as one <a href="https://www.complex.com/pop-culture/the-flash-early-reactions" target="_blank" rel="noopener">of the best superhero movies ever made</a>. That couldn't be further from the truth.</p><p>There's a scene early in Warner Bros.' latest DC outing where the titular hero (Ezra Miller) saves a group of babies and a nurse from falling to their deaths.</p><p>The dragged out, slowed-down scene involves a baby getting closed inside an unplugged microwave to save its life. Then, Miller's Barry Allen/The Flash offers mental health advice to a screaming nurse who's in shock. </p><p>It's supposed to elicit laughter. Yet the fact that these scenes made the film's final cut given Miller's <a href="https://www.insider.com/ezra-miller-controversies-timeline-arrests-reports-2022-8">legal troubles</a>, "<a href="https://www.insider.com/ezra-miller-is-seeking-help-for-complex-mental-health-issues-2022-8">complex mental health issues</a>," and <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/ezra-miller-flash-running-a-cult-grooming-minors-carrying-guns-2022-8">accusations of grooming children</a> make it difficult to separate the actor from his superhero facade. </p><p>It gets better from there, but "The Flash" isn't the spectacle some critics and <a href="https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/tom-cruise-has-seen-the-flash-movie-1235355326/" target="_blank" rel="noopener">celebrities</a> promised months ago.</p><p>The Andy Muschietti-directed movie, which has been <a href="https://apnews.com/article/flash-movie-timeline-ezra-miller-b5cc7751677e1bdf7701a29b398c8e6d" target="_blank" rel="noopener">in development as far back as the '80s,</a> loosely follows the popular DC story "Flashpoint," in which the speedster travels back in time to prevent the death of his mother (Maribel Verdú) during his childhood. Unfortunately, changing the past alters the present. </p><p>The Flash finds himself trapped in an alternate timeline where the Justice League doesn't exist and Superman villain Zod (Michael Shannon from 2013's "Man of Steel") threatens to once again take over Earth and transform it into a new home for his nearly extinct Kryptonian race.</p><p>Barry runs into his past self, a doe-eyed dingbat sans superpowers, and together they need to stop Zod and send the hero home. Help comes in the form of Supergirl (Sasha Calle) and a blast from the past — Michael Keaton's Batman, a cameo that's strategically been used in marketing, likely to take some of the attention off the film's troubled star.</p><p>Stuffed with unnecessary cameos seemingly for the sake of it, "The Flash" contains glimpses of fun, but is tonally uneven. It's often in conflict with itself over whether it wants to be a Batman nostalgia fest or about the fastest man alive.<strong><em> </em></strong></p><h2><strong>Michael Keaton's Batman is the best thing about 'The Flash' </strong></h2><div type="image" title="Michael Keaton as Batman in &quot;The Flash.&quot;" height="720" width="1280" msid="101052185" hostid="261"></div><p>Let's be real. Despite being called "The Flash," audiences are likely venturing to theaters to see Keaton's reprisal as the Dark Knight. And Keaton doesn't disappoint. </p><p>"The Flash" meanders and relies on cringey and juvenile jokes for much of its first hour. (The film lingers on an unfunny gag that will go over young viewers' heads about <a href="https://screenrant.com/back-future-original-marty-fired-eric-stoltz-why/" target="_blank" rel="noopener">Eric Stoltz playing Marty McFly in "Back to the Future"</a> in a different timeline for far too long.) </p><p>It's not until Keaton shows up to fight two versions of the Flash with a broom on a table in nothing but sweats and one flip flop that the movie livens up. </p><p>Every moment with Keaton on screen makes this movie worth watching. The actor gets the film's best fight sequence while effortlessly taking down Russians to Danny Elfman's familiar theme. </p><p>Keaton reminds us his Batman can do anything efficiently, including delivering the most straightforward explanation of the multiverse in any comic-book movie to date using nothing more than a bowl of spaghetti. </p><h2><strong>Every other hero outshines The Flash in this movie.</strong></h2><p><strong></strong></p><div type="image" title="Michael Keaton as Batman in The Flash" height="1582" width="3000" msid="101052188" hostid="261"></div><p>Miller gets overshadowed in their own film any time a version of Batman shows up (I won't spoil them all here). Affleck's latest and likely last outing as the Caped Crusader delivers an exciting chase scene through Gotham, while Keaton and one other Batman received the majority of the cheers in my early June screening filled with fans and journalists.</p><p>At times, it feels like you're watching a follow-up to Tim Burton's "Batman Returns" instead of a standalone about the speedster. Throughout the film, Flash relies on Bats to formulate plans to get them out of trouble, help him restore his powers, and take down Zod.</p><p>The result is that The Flash feels more like a sidekick in his own film — even the movie poster has an identity crisis over which hero should be featured more prominently in a film titled "The Flash."</p><div type="image" title="The Flash poster" height="4096" width="2764" msid="101052191" hostid="261"></div><p>It's not just the Batmen who steal scenes.</p><p>Sasha Calle's Supergirl is another bright spot, featured in an adaptation of the popular "Red Son" Superman comic that explores what would've happened if Supes crash landed in Russia instead of a farm in Kansas. Though the film barely scratches the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superman:_Red_Son" target="_blank" rel="noopener">surface of the Eisner-winning Mark Millar story</a>, Calle taps into a darker, more vengeful version of the hero than we've previously seen. </p><div type="image" title="Ezra Miller in The Flash" height="1666" width="3000" msid="101052194" hostid="261"></div><p>Unfortunately, without giving away spoilers, the way the film wraps up Keaton and Calle's storylines makes it seem likely this will be the last time we see them in live-action.</p><h2><strong>The film is riddled with awful CGI</strong></h2><p><strong></strong></p><div type="image" title="the flash ezra miller" height="1170" width="2642" msid="101052197" hostid="261"></div><p>Noticeably wonky CGI makes "The Flash" tough to fully enjoy.</p><p>The babies Flash saves near the film's start <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=the%20flash%20microwave&amp;src=typed_query" target="_blank" rel="noopener">look nightmarish</a>. Any time the hero enters the Speed Force to try and turn back time, viewers see humans who look strangely animated, as if editors didn't have time to complete the film's effects. </p><p>Apparently, it was intended to look "<a href="https://gizmodo.com/flash-movie-visual-effects-warner-bros-dc-films-batman-1850540141" target="_blank" rel="noopener">a little weird.</a>" Muschietti and his sister, Barbara, who serves as a film's producer, <a href="https://gizmodo.com/flash-movie-visual-effects-warner-bros-dc-films-batman-1850540141" target="_blank" rel="noopener">told io9's Germain Lussier the CGI isn't a mistake</a>. The visuals look the way they do on purpose to showcase those moments from Barry's point of view. </p><p>Such an explanation would be fine; however, viewers have <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtswU-tBq6g" target="_blank" rel="noopener">seen scenes from Barry's POV in previous DC films</a> where his surroundings look well-defined. This jarring new take doesn't match with what's been introduced in the past. </p><h2><strong>There's a better adaptation of 'Flashpoint' you can watch on Max.</strong></h2><p><strong></strong></p><div type="image" title="Ezra Miller behind another version of himself as The Flash and Sasha Calle as Supergirl" height="1800" width="3331" msid="101052200" hostid="261"></div><p>"The Flash" is very good when it's a Batman movie and mediocre when it's about Barry Allen. </p><p>The film fails to answer its biggest question: Who killed Barry's mom? Any fan familiar with The CW's nine-season "Flash" series — a show that debuted after WB's 2014 movie <a href="https://www.slashfilm.com/534369/dc-movie-slate-revealed/" target="_blank" rel="noopener">announcement</a> and <a href="https://people.com/the-flash-series-finale-how-it-ends-7503686" target="_blank" rel="noopener">concluded</a> weeks before its release — knows the culprit as Reverse Flash. Here, the question is ignored despite being at the heart of the film.</p><p>A Flash baddie could've naturally tied into the film's main story. </p><p>Instead, "The Flash" bizarrely reintroduces Zod, a stale but familiar villain from one of DC's most divisive films, 2013's "Man of Steel," with a cliché goal of overtaking the planet. </p><p>In doing so, the studio oddly revisits <a href="https://www.goodmorningamerica.com/culture/story/warner-bros-snyderverse-zack-snyders-justice-league-76628238" target="_blank" rel="noopener">the Snyderverse era of DC that WB refused to continue</a>. (As a reminder, Henry Cavill <a href="https://variety.com/2022/film/news/superman-henry-cavill-black-adam-1235323670/" target="_blank" rel="noopener">reprised his role as Superman in October's "Black Adam"</a> only to be kicked to the curb <a href="https://www.insider.com/henry-cavill-confirms-he-will-no-longer-play-superman-2022-12">two months later</a>.)</p><p>By the film's end, Barry doesn't learn his lesson about fiddling with the past as his selfish actions result in another (less life-threatening) shift to the multiverse. It feels like a rushed sunset and solution to cleanly reset the DC universe moving forward, likely without Miller.</p><p>WB already made a more enjoyable Flashpoint adaptation in 2013 called "<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3tochTgPVc" target="_blank" rel="noopener">Justice League: The Flashpoint Paradox</a>," currently <a href="https://play.max.com/movie/61e4efde-a2e8-47d8-a174-ab654ae6eb3f" target="_blank" rel="noopener">streaming on Max</a>. After you get your Keaton fix, watch that.</p><p><em>"The Flash," also starring Kiersey Clemons and Ron Livingston, is now in theaters.</em></p><h2><strong>Grade:</strong> C+</h2>

Batman aside, 'The Flash' is far from one of the best superhero movies ever made

<p>Today, "<keyword id="12151275" type="UNKNOWN" weightage="60" keywordseo="men-in-black" source="Orion">Men in Black</keyword>" is considered a landmark action-comedy that cemented Will Smith as a global-box-office draw and showcased how computer graphics would elevate Hollywood blockbusters for decades to come.</p><p>But 25 years ago, the movie was hardly a sure thing. </p><p>Based on a little-known comic-book series from Marvel, Sony had no idea what it had its hands on when it began developing the project about a pair of agents (Tommy Lee Jones and Smith) from a secret organization that watches over aliens living on Earth. There were also a few hiccups at the start: the two leads were neither of the producers' first picks, and director Barry Sonnenfeld had left the project twice before shooting began.</p><p>But by the time the movie was in the can, things were looking promising. Steven Spielberg came on as an executive producer and Smith had become a huge star thanks to "Independence Day," which became a gigantic hit right around the time "Men in Black" wrapped production.</p><p>The movie ended up becoming a box-office sensation, and even still gets regular play on cable networks like TNT. From Jones and Smith's funny banter to the alien characters created by creature-effects legend Rick Baker (who won the best makeup Oscar for his efforts), the movie, which spawned two sequels also directed by Sonnenfeld, remains an extremely enjoyable watch all these years later.</p><p>For the movie's 25th anniversary, Insider spoke to Sonnenfeld over the phone from his home in British Columbia.</p><p><strong>The director recalled never-before-told insights like the famous line that Smith came up with on the spot, what he had to do to get a Michael Jackson cameo in the sequel, and why he thinks the franchise reboot attempt with 2019's "Men in Black: International" starring Tessa Thompson and Chris Hemsworth didn't work.</strong></p><div type="image" title="Will Smith in a black suit and black sun glasses" height="4197" width="2782" msid="92600526" hostid="261"></div><h2>Sonnenfeld purposely undersold Chris O'Donnell on the movie so he could cast Will Smith instead</h2><p><strong>Previous to making 1995's "Get Shorty," you were developing "Men in Black" but couldn't see eye-to-eye with producers Walter F. Parkes and Laurie MacDonald. So you left the film. What led to you finally signing back on to direct?</strong></p><p>I was developing "Men in Black" for a very long time and finally, after six years of trying, I was able to get "Get Shorty" made so I left "Men in Black" to do "Get Shorty." But I had heard they hadn't gotten a director they were sticking with.</p><p>I was in L.A. having breakfast with my wife at The Ivy and at the next table was Barry Josephson, who was head of production at Sony at that time. I said, "Listen, if you're willing to wait until I'm done with 'Get Shorty' I would love to come back on 'Men in Black.'"</p><p>So it was kind of kismet that I ran into Josephson. Otherwise, it's possible I never would have gotten involved again. </p><p><strong>Legend has it that the producers wanted Clint Eastwood and Chris O'Donnell to play the leads. When you returned to "Men in Black," was that still the case?</strong></p><p>When we started up again, those were the two names in the mix. I had suggested Tommy Lee Jones and Will Smith. Will was actually my wife's idea. They went out to Tommy Lee Jones and he said he would consider it if there was a rewrite of the script.</p><p>Then during that rewrite, Tommy got director approval so because of that I was off the movie again. This was for about four or five months. The irony is that Tommy was my idea to be in the movie in the first place. </p><p><strong>So how did you get back on the film?</strong></p><p>I had a meal with Tommy in Santa Monica about five months later after he said the latest rewrite was good enough for him to sign on. I had dinner with him and it worked out. </p><div type="image" title="Chris O'Donnell in a tuxedo" height="3000" width="1954" msid="92600528" hostid="261"></div>Then it was Walter, Laurie, and Spielberg who felt Chris O'Donnell would be good. I think he's a good actor, but I had really been thinking about Will since my wife made the suggestion.<p>I met with Chris and he had concerns about the script and had another movie offer. So I told him, "Yeah, we might never fix this script and I don't think I know how to direct this movie." So he passed on the movie the next day. </p><p>I used to live in the Hamptons and Steven Spielberg used to summer there so I was able to arrange for Will to come up from Philly — he was at a wedding — to come and meet Steven and myself and Walter and Laurie. And that's how Will got the part. </p><p><strong>Is it true David Schwimmer was in the running for the J role at one time?</strong></p><p>Um, yes, that rings a bell. But I always thought about Will for the role. </p><p><strong>So let's be clear, you kind of undersold it big time to Chris O'Donnell. </strong></p><p>Well, you know what, you always want to underpromise and overdeliver.</p><div type="image" title="Will Smith holding a baby alien" height="1515" width="2310" msid="92600530" hostid="261"></div><h2>An early showing of the movie to friends and family was a disaster</h2><p><strong>You started principal photography around March 1996. By that July, Will Smith is a global star due to "Independence Day." Did the success of that movie change at all how Will's J character evolved during shooting or just how you would use Will in the marketing of the movie?</strong></p><p>No, it didn't. I think "Independence Day" came out in the last two weeks of our principal photography and Will was already a bigger-than-life presence in the room so it was great that we didn't have to film through months of box-office records, it was just the opening weekend. </p><p><strong>Going into post-production, did you feel you were playing with house money because now you had hitmaker Will Smith?</strong></p><p>No, because you never know that. If you start thinking that way, it's bad news.</p><p>In fact, we had a family and friends screening near the end of the editing where we didn't have the visual effects in and it was a disaster. People who were at the screening — my agent, my lawyer, Ethan Coen — after the movie was released and was a hit they all said, "We lied to you when we said it's going to be good after the friends-and-family showing. We didn't think it would be."</p><p><strong>And what about Will Smith doing <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fiBLgEx6svA">the "Men in Black" song</a>? Did the idea come before "Independent Day" was released?</strong></p><p>That was in post-production when we asked Will to do the song. But truthfully, we would have done that regardless of how "Independent Day" did just because of his hip-hop career.</p><p>And we did a big-budget music video for the song — that was really less about "Independence Day" and more because Sony had seen the movie and felt it was going to be a big hit. But it sure didn't hurt that "Independence Day" was such a big movie. </p><div type="image" title="Tommy Lee Jones in a black suit" height="4192" width="2774" msid="92600532" hostid="261"></div><h2>It took a long time for Tommy Lee Jones to accept being the straight man to Will Smith</h2><p><strong>Was there a moment on set when you could tell Tommy and Will were clicking?</strong></p><p>It's funny, they really clicked both on- and off-camera. They really enjoyed each other. They both thought each other was funny. For me, personally, the very first time we shot with both of them together is that <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FkVXCCfg2A">pawn-shop scene with Jack Jeebs</a> (played by Tony Shalhoub) and they both were perfect.</p><p>Will ad-libbed that last line of, "Yeah, I'm gonna come back about those Rolexes." Right away I knew they would work out well. </p><p><strong>Through doing the rewrites and going into shooting, was Tommy on board with being <a href="https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/StraightMan">the straight man</a> in essentially this comedy duo with Will?</strong></p><p>It took a long time for him to feel comfortable with it. I don't think he ever did. I don't think he understood that comedy. In fact, I really sat on his performance. I never wanted him to acknowledge anything Will said was funny or was a joke.</p><p>I got a call from Tommy's agent about two weeks into the movie and he said, "I don't want Tommy to be funny, I only want Will to be funny." And I promised him that when Tommy sees this movie, Tommy will realize he's as funny as Will Smith is. Every comedy team needs a straight man.</p><div type="image" title="Vincent D'Onofrio dressed in overalls as &quot;Men in Black&quot; villain Bug" height="688" width="1264" msid="92600534" hostid="261"></div><strong>But I would imagine the biggest wild card, in regards to characters, was the Edgar/Bug character that Vincent D'Onofrio plays. He could have gone so many different ways with that role. Is it true you didn't hear what voice he was going to do until the first day of shooting him?</strong><p>Yes. And I was 100% on board. </p><p>The other thing he did that was fantastic is his voice changes over the course of his time on Earth because he becomes more and more bug-like. In fact, near the end of the movie when he comes into the morgue to find the cat and where he kills the character played by David Cross, he's almost impersonating John Huston from "Chinatown."</p><p>He was great to work with and understood you can be funny without trying to be funny. I love that he's so annoyed because he's in this human suit, which was brilliantly conceived by Rick Baker. </p><p><strong>Is it true Linda Fiorentino got the role of Dr. Laurel Weaver because she played against you in a poker game?</strong></p><p>That's her legend. She claimed that she won the part in the poker game, but that's not true. Someone invited me to a poker game and Linda happened to be at my table. So when it came time to cast for that role, she was someone I immediately thought about because I had just played poker with her. </p><div type="image" title="Michael Jackson in &quot;Men in Black&quot; suit with penguins behind him" height="562" width="1000" msid="92600535" hostid="261"></div><h2>Michael Jackson refused to play an alien in "Men in Black II"</h2><p><strong>A great moment in the movie is <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbxA9p_nCGc">the observation board scene</a> that shows all the aliens living among us on Earth: Al Roker, Sylvester Stallone, Steven Spielberg, George Lucas, Danny DeVito. <br /></strong></p><p>Yeah. I wanted to have people up there that made you go, "Yeah, he could be an alien."</p><p><strong>Now in "Men in Black II" you show off the board in a different way, it's where you have <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_F4BkPGSRA">the Michael Jackson cameo</a>. How did you get him to do that?</strong></p><p>He approached us.</p><p><strong>Really? Did he just want to be in the movie?</strong></p><p>Well, I was going to make him an alien and he said, "No, I want to wear the 'Men in Black' suit." So we figured out how to do that and it worked out. He was lovely. </p><div type="image" title="Tommy Lee Jones and Will Smith standing across from Linda Fiorentino" height="1497" width="2297" msid="92600537" hostid="261"></div><h2>Initially, Sonnenfeld didn't like Danny Elfman's score and he had to go to the composer's 'scary' house to tell him</h2><p><strong>The secret sauce to the whole franchise, but particularly this movie, is Danny Elfman's score. You know the movie is going to be a fun time just from the music. How did he come up with the score?</strong></p><p>I went to Marc Shaiman first because he had done my movies "The Addams Family" and "Addams Family Values," but he wasn't available. I went to Danny and he agreed to do it. I really admired Danny's work.</p><p>Early on, we gave Danny some scenes to write music for, just so I could see if we were on the same page. And he had a place in Malibu that was so dark and so scary. I go into this bunker that he had on this Malibu property, it's pitch black outside, he's got skeletons, taxidermy. I'm pretty freaked out. And the initial stuff Danny played for me was totally wrong.</p><p>I started to sweat because I was about to tell Danny Elfman, who I truly admire from the Tim Burton stuff, that he needed to go in a totally different direction tonally. I didn't know how he was going to take that. </p><p>I basically told him that he was hitting the jokes and helping me with the comedy but I didn't want any help with the comedy. I wanted the audience to decide what was funny and what wasn't on their own. I didn't want an actor to wink at the camera or the music to do that. I told him where I needed help, was the music needed gravitas and emotion. And he totally got it.</p><p>About a week later, I drove back to that horrible place of his again and what he played for me was fantastic. </p><div type="image" title="Tommy Lee Jones in black suit talking to aliens at coffee counter" height="1542" width="2348" msid="92600540" hostid="261"></div><h2>The aliens who talk to Tommy Lee Jones were pullets, not CGI</h2><p><strong>The fascinating thing about watching the movie now is that, while you were making it, a major shift to CGI is happening in Hollywood. Yes, you have Rick Baker but "Jurassic Park" has been out for a few years and all the blockbusters are going heavy on CG. How did you balance the two on this movie?</strong></p><p>I was really lucky that I had Rick because not only did he design all the makeup but he designed all the aliens. And early on, he said, "Whenever you can don't use CGI, use puppets." Because puppeteers are members of SAG, meaning they are actors and will work off and ad-lib with the on-screen actors. </p><p>A perfect example is <a href="https://youtu.be/WS93LMcRGRk?t=72">the aliens in the break room</a> where Tommy's character stops to get coffee. Those are all rod puppets. We shot it in a flat-to-the-wall way so the puppeteers are behind that wall. We didn't even have to digitally remove any rods.</p><p>When Tommy says, "That's not decaf is it?" that was ad-libbed on the day in real-time. I told Tommy to say that. Then I told the puppeteer to answer in the alien voice: "Viennese Cinnamon."</p><p>Now when we see those aliens again, they are walking away with all the duty-free stuff, that's a wide shot so the only way to do that was CGI. </p><p><strong>It's funny you bring up Tommy talking to the aliens because I remember when the movie came out, stories used that scene as an example of how amazing the CGI is in the movie.</strong></p><p>Yeah! They were puppets.</p><div type="image" title="Will Smith wearing sunglasses" height="728" width="1440" msid="92600541" hostid="261"></div><h2>Will Smith came up with the famous "I make this look good" line on the day of filming</h2><p><strong>Will Smith's <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AKe70SX8OM">famous line in the movie</a> once he puts on the "Men in Black" suit for the first time: "You know what the difference is between you and me? I make this look good." Is there a story behind that line?</strong></p><p>Yes. That came on the day during rehearsals. Will was always ad-libbing funny stuff. Some I used and some I didn't. But with that shot, I pushed the camera on him low, that whole delivery, yeah, he came up with that on the day.</p><p>Also, the line at the end when Will is looking at the mural of the World's Fair and he turns and says to Tommy and <a href="https://metro.co.uk/2019/07/10/old-actor-rip-torn-play-men-black-10146312/">Rip</a>, "Hey, old guys." That was also a Will ad-lib. </p><div type="image" title="men in black international trailer" height="1126" width="2208" msid="92600543" hostid="261"></div><h2>Sonnenfeld says he's never seen "Men in Black: International," though he's an executive producer on the movie</h2><p><strong>The movie came out on July 2, 1997, and did amazing business, better than anyone expected. You have not made it a secret that making parts two and three were challenging. When it comes to this franchise, is it simply too many voices in the room — producers, talent, studio — trying to get their way?</strong></p><p>The issue is the first one came out and it was, at the time, the biggest box-office grosser in Sony's history. So it was a big deal.</p><p>Then, the studio and the producers decided to hire a writer for "Men in Black II" and never consulted me about the story, anything. So by the time I got the script for the first time I was not only given a script that I didn't think was right tonally but also given a release date for the movie opening. </p><p><strong>Do you think they were fishing for another director in that time when they were developing the sequel and finally settled on you?</strong></p><p>I don't know. </p><p><strong>So you get through the third film. They attempt to reboot the franchise in 2019 with "Men in Black: International," which you were an executive producer on. Were you surprised it didn't do well?</strong></p><p>I had nothing to do with it. I just got a credit. By the end of the third movie, I knew that Will, Tommy, and I were done with the franchise. The thing that's funny is "Men in Black: International" is directed by F. Gary Gray who also directed "Be Cool," the sequel to "Get Shorty."</p><p>Anyway, I think the "Men in Black" franchise, at least the first three, has a certain tone: this is all real and the comedy comes out of absurd reality. The laughs didn't come out of jokes or acknowledging that something you did or said is a joke. Also, you need two different kinds of performers. You really do need a straight man and a comedian. You need Jerry Lewis and Dean Martin. </p><p>Now, I didn't see "Men in Black: International," but I've seen the trailer and I didn't think there was enough difference in attitude between the leads. Maybe I'm wrong, but I feel you don't want two funny people in your movie, ever. </p><div type="image" title="Will Smith in a white shirt standing next to Barry Sonnenfeld in a hat and dark shirt" height="1336" width="1781" msid="92600544" hostid="261"></div><h2>Sonnenfeld would do another "Men in Black" movie if Will Smith were attached</h2><p><strong>Have you ever seen the <a href="https://www.syfy.com/syfy-wire/phil-lord-chris-miller-on-men-in-black-jump-street-crossover">"Men in Black/21 Jumpstreet" crossover script</a>?</strong></p><p>I've never seen a page of it. I think it seems like an expensive idea with a lot of high-priced producers let alone actors. </p><p><strong>If Will Smith ever called you and said, "I'm thinking of doing another one," would that sway you to direct another "Men in Black"?</strong></p><p>Sure. </p><p><strong>Has that conversation ever happened?</strong></p><p>Nope. </p><p><em>This <keyword id="11905869" type="UNKNOWN" weightage="60" keywordseo="interview" source="Orion">interview</keyword> has been condensed and edited for clarity.</em></p>

'Men in Black' at 25: Director Barry Sonnenfeld shares which famous line Will Smith made up on the spot and reveals why Michael Jackson refused to play an alien

<ul class="summary-list"><li>Screenwriter Caroline Thompson spoke to Insider about <keyword id="10394" type="PERSON" weightage="60" keywordseo="Tim-Burton">Tim Burton</keyword>'s iconic movie "<keyword id="3339673" type="ENTERTAINMENT" weightage="60" keywordseo="The-Nightmare-Before-Christmas">The Nightmare Before Christmas</keyword>," which, it turns out, was quite a ride to make.</li><li>Thompson, who also wrote "Edward Scissorhands," said that a previous screenwriter "snorted his salary" and so she was brought on for "The Nightmare Before <keyword id="8206" type="ORGANIZATION" weightage="60" keywordseo="Christmas">Christmas</keyword>."</li><li>Thompson added that she had arguments with director Henry Selick, as well as producer Tim Burton who screamed at her and attacked an editing machine after she said she wanted to redraft the ending.</li></ul><p>"The Nightmare Before Christmas" reached cult status a while ago. It didn't set Disney executives alight, which is why it was moved to Touchstone (Disney after dark), and it didn't connect with audiences upon release, either.</p><p>But Caroline Thompson, the screenwriter who wrote the movie, told Insider that she knew the movie would find its audience eventually when she saw the daughter of her then-partner Danny Elfman ("Nightmare" composer) singing and dancing to the movie's songs non-stop.</p><p>And become iconic it did, with endless merchandise and video games and theme park presence only helping to catapult it to cult status. Add to that the fact that the film is, as Thompson so firmly puts it, both a Christmas movie and a <keyword id="600" type="ENTERTAINMENT" weightage="60" keywordseo="Halloween">Halloween</keyword> movie, the 24/7 love and yearly obsession with "The Nightmare Before Christmas" isn't waning anytime soon.</p><div type="image" title="Caroline Thompson attends Universal Pictures and DreamWorks Pictures' premiere of 'Welcome To Marwen' at ArcLight Hollywood on December 10, 2018 in Hollywood, California. (Photo by Rich Fury/FilmMagic)" height="1002" width="1333" msid="79570275" hostid="261"></div><p>But behind Henry Selick's stop-motion genius and Danny Elfman's catchy songs and the spooky-yet-Disney tale of warning weaved by Thompson is a different sort of legend altogether.</p><p>What became clear during Insider's chat with Thompson is just how much of it was, as she herself put it, a "f---ing grind" to make. From clashes with producer Tim Burton to a previous screenwriter more concerned with drugs than words to characters that could be interpreted as racist, the project wasn't the smooth ride it is to watch.</p><p>In fact, you might even say that the making of "The Nightmare Before Christmas" was, well, a nightmare.</p><div type="image" title="Edward Scissorhands disability post 2" height="1200" width="1600" msid="79570278" hostid="261"></div><h2>Thompson wrote 'Edward Scissorhands,' but wasn't invited back for 'The Nightmare Before Christmas'</h2><p>Thompson worked with Tim Burton, the executive producer of "Nightmare," in 1990 on "Edward Scissorhands" - another gothic masterpiece. That movie was a roaring success, launching the careers of both Burton as a director and Depp as one of the most interesting and talented leading men around. It was also a masterclass in character-led writing with minimal dialogue (for its lead character, anyway).</p><p>So when the time came for the next Burton project, which also featured "Scissorhands" composer Danny Elfman, Thompson was surprised not to be asked to join the movie. The fact that she was going out with Elfman at the time didn't help.</p><p>"I was really p---ed off I wasn't invited to join the project because I'd just done 'Edward' with Tim. But Tim's a funny person," Thompson said.</p><div type="image" title="Danny Elfman The Nightmare Before Christmas" height="1200" width="1600" msid="79570279" hostid="261"></div><h2>The original writer 'snorted his salary and didn't write,' so Thompson was brought on</h2><p>"When it was time to turn in the script, Michael [McDowell,] who had a serious drug problem, I guess snorted his salary and didn't write, and he delivered nothing," Thompson said. "He just took Danny's lyrics and reformatted them as if they were a screenplay. And that's all he turned in."</p><p>To make matters worse, Burton, Selick, McDowell, and company were already shooting by this time. In fact, they were actually animating Lock, Shock, and Barrell's song "Kidnap the Sandy Claws."</p><iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/7ckTdwZqP90" frameborder="0"></iframe><p>"They were up s---'s creek," Thompson said. "So the head of the studio came to me and said could you help us."</p><h2>'It was like building a house that people were already living in'</h2><p>"Nightmare" follows Jack Skellington, king of Halloween Town, discovering Christmas Town amidst inner personal crisis. It's a fairly meaty story, but Thompson's issue was that "it was like building a house that people were already living in." Production was underway, animation had begun, as had shooting, and the story was really told by Elfman's songs.</p><p>"It was a very difficult thing to help. There was nothing really to tell, so the story that was left to me was Sally's story," Thompson said. Sally was redesigned into a match-stick-like girl at Thompson's request, and she managed to develop her character with just two images as inspiration.</p><p>With these two images, Thompson managed to create the story for Sally about her need for independence and rebellion against her creator, the Frankenstein-like Dr. Finklestein. And she did it in just one week when she and Elfman went on a seaside retreat.</p><p>"It sounds really impressive but it isn't because in those days an animated film was only 75 minutes. And Danny had written all the songs, so it was like writing 45 pages."</p><iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/8rivTGBzBMM" frameborder="0"></iframe><p>However, Eflman didn't like one part of Thompson's work. The Mayor of Halloween town was inspired by American politics and their "two-faced bulls--- in general." Thompson even compared the Mayor to Donald Trump: "He is the apotheosis of that impulse, but not the only embodiment of it."</p><p>But Elfman wasn't a fan, and told Thompson while on their couple's retreat that the idea "was terrible" and "not what [he] had in mind at all."</p><p>"I gave Danny the script on the retreat, and he said: 'Oh, no that's terrible. That's not what I had in mind at all.' And I was like sorry, it's not about you."</p><iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/OBwf2r1SQkU" frameborder="0"></iframe><h2>Thompson hated Oogie Boogie, who she perceived as racist</h2><p>In a mirrored scenario, Thompson found herself unsatisfied and very uncomfortable with a different character. The villain of the piece, Oogie Boogie. Voiced by Ken Page, the character is the bogeyman of Halloween Town with a penchant for gambling, and his song is a <a href="https://oldschoolnewschoolmusic.wordpress.com/2015/09/17/cab-calloways-influence-on-the-nightmare-before-christmas/">Cab Calloway-inspired</a> blues number. But Oogie Boogie was, and still is, "a big controversy" for Thompson.</p><p>"First of all, he looks like a Klu Klux Klansman. Secondly, 'Oogie Boogie' is an old, southern, derogatory phrase for an African-American, and I'm from Maryland, which is just on the cusp of the south, so I'm hyper-aware of that and sensitive to it," Thompson said. She also took issue with a black man being cast as the character.</p><p>"I was just flipped out about it. I went to Tim, I went to Henry, and I said we got to change this," Thompson said. But Burton, whose final decision it was, wasn't interested in the matter and told Thompson she was being "oversensitive."</p><p>"I'm still really embarrassed by it. It's all kind of 'urgh,' and I thought it was incredibly insensitive."</p><iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/2Bmec1VVYxw" frameborder="0"></iframe><h2>Thompson told Tim Burton she didn't like the ending, so Burton attacked an editing machine</h2><p>This wasn't the end of conflict, between Thompson and Burton. The production was littered with disagreements and spats, she said.</p><div type="image" title="Tim Burton" height="1200" width="1600" msid="79570280" hostid="261"></div><p>Thompson said she told Burton she felt Jack and Sally's relationship needed "another couple of beats" in order to feel truly earned and not just tacked on for the sake of some sort of romance. She did admit that on a recent reviewing, she was glad to see Jack climbing the hill to Sally to join her instead of the other way around: "at least it's a little feminist correct. Over the years, I thought Sally was kind of a tool."</p><p>Still, Thompson wanted to have another go at the ending to get it right. But Burton wasn't interested.</p><p>"He just basically turned around and started screaming and attacking an editing machine. They make Tim look like a ten-pound weakling, these things are huge, metal machines you can't move off of the floor," Thompson said.</p><p>She continued: "Tim was there ramming it, screaming at me. I was okay. People have their ways of dealing with stress, and that was his and that's fine. But I never got a chance to take another crack at it. I didn't get the impression that if I arrived with more pages, they would be even be read let alone welcomed.</p><p>"Sadly, Tim and I are not in touch," Thompson said. "We've had what I would call our 13th breakup. I hope he regrets it."</p><h2>Henry Selick has never gotten credit he deserves for the movie, Thompson said</h2><div type="image" title="Henry Selick Coraline" height="1200" width="1600" msid="79570282" hostid="261"></div><p>The topic of "director" is an interesting one when discussing "The Nightmare Before Christmas." Similar to Steven Spielberg and director Tobe Hooper on 1982's "Poltergeist," there's a general confusion-come-debate over who was truly in charge of "Nightmare." Henry Selick is credited as director, but Burton produced and conceived it, based, apparently on a poem he wrote when he was younger. The movie is even called "Tim Burton's The Nightmare Before Christmas."</p><p>"That tells you the whole story right there. The mythology that it was based on his poem - I never read that poem. I don't recall ever seeing it," Thompson said. She also said the same of the mythology surrounding "Edward Scissorhands," wherein the idea was supposedly based on a drawing of Edward Burton did when he was a teen. Thompson never saw this, either.</p><p>"Tim, to be perfectly honest, swooped in to be involved with 'Nightmare' but wasn't there by any stretch of the imagination," Thompson said. "It was Henry's project. And I sincerely don't feel that Henry has ever really gotten the credit that he's due for it. He did a beautiful, beautiful job."</p><div type="image" title="Dumbo Disney remake" height="1200" width="1600" msid="79570283" hostid="261"></div><h2>Thompson says a Disney live-action remake would be 'greedy and stupid'</h2><p>"'Nightmare' seemed like an endless experience. It was at least two years, maybe more. That's a f---ing grind," Thompson said.</p><p>However, she's still proud to have been involved in one of the most iconic animated movies of all time, and loves the passion and fervor people feel for the film. Thompson recounts seeing life-sized status of Jack Skellington in Spain, and all around the world, and is touched every time she sees a slice of merchandise of her movie.</p><p>"It's very cool. It's such an amazing gift to have been able to have contributed positively, I hope, to the culture," Thompson said.</p><p>Before his <a href="https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/john-lasseters-pattern-alleged-misconduct-detailed-by-disney-pixar-insiders-1059594">fall from grace</a>, Thompson said Disney heavyweight and "Toy Story" director John Lasseter told her that Pixar would never have existed without "Nightmare."</p><p>"He said it told Disney that they didn't have to keep plumbing the old Disney songbook. That they could be original."</p><p>But would Disney ever return to "Nightmare?" A sequel has been touted several times, but always squashed by Burton himself. However, Disney is ploughing through their back catalogue of animated classics and transforming them into live-action remakes, to varying degrees of success.</p><p>"Nightmare" would be the boldest remake yet for Disney. A live-action Jack Skellington in a live-action Halloween Town. Would Thompson be down for that?</p><p>"That would be so awful," she said.</p><p>"I hope Tim has enough rights that they can't do that. It's superfluous. That's greedy and stupid."</p><p><strong>Read more:</strong></p><p><a href="https://www.insider.com/nightmare-before-christmas-facts-2018-9">18 things you probably didn't know about 'The Nightmare Before Christmas'</a></p><p><a href="https://www.insider.com/edward-scissorhands-johnny-depp-writer-caroline-thompson-margarita-every-morning-2020-11">'Edward Scissorhands' writer says Johnny Depp used to greet her 'every morning with a margarita'</a></p><p><a href="https://www.insider.com/edward-scissorhands-screenwriter-cried-icon-people-with-disabilities-2020-11">'Edward Scissorhands' screenwriter said she cried when she realized the movie's importance to people with disabilities</a></p>

Screaming, smashing editing machines and a 'snorted salary': Inside the tumultuous making of 'The Nightmare Before Christmas'

<ul class="summary-list"><li>TikTokers are rating items from <keyword id="6359938" type="UNKNOWN" weightage="60" keywordseo="target">Target</keyword>'s <keyword id="6534458" type="UNKNOWN" weightage="60" keywordseo="Pride">Pride</keyword> collection, ranging from shirts to pillows.</li><li>Some said certain items were "ugly," while one TikToker said the collection "lowkey sucks."</li><li>The videos critique a phenomenon that's been dubbed "rainbow capitalism."</li></ul><p>Pride Month is just a few weeks away, which means it's time for stores to stock up on <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/reviews/out?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.target.com%2Fp%2Fpride-gender-inclusive-adult-be-you-short-sleeve-graphic-t-shirt-white%2F-%2FA-81831469%3Fpreselect%3D81623881%23lnk%3Dsametab">rainbow tees</a>, <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/reviews/out?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.target.com%2Fp%2Fpride-gender-inclusive-adult-rainbow-bandana-2pk%2F-%2FA-81624197%23lnk%3Dsametab">bandanas</a>, <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/reviews/out?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.target.com%2Fp%2Fpet-t-shirt-tutu-skirt-rainbow-pride%2F-%2FA-82005801%3Fpreselect%3D81640199%23lnk%3Dsametab">dog outfits</a>, <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/reviews/out?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.target.com%2Fp%2F14oz-lidded-glass-jar-2-wick-rainbow-swirl-candle-pride%2F-%2FA-81640108%23lnk%3Dsametab">candles</a>, and even <a href="https://www.absolut.com/us/products/absolut-rainbow/">bottles of Pride-themed Absolut Vodka</a>. Now, <keyword id="6762469" type="UNKNOWN" weightage="60" keywordseo="TikTok">TikTok</keyword> users are taking to the platform to rate Pride merchandise from stores like Target, Hot Topic, and Walmart. </p><p>Multiple videos making fun of this trend have recently gone viral ahead of Pride Month in June, amassing hundreds of thousands of likes, with users going through Pride collection items one by one and assigning them different ratings.</p><p>Items range from a T-shirt that lists nametags with pronouns, along with a tag that reads "ask me" to a pink tank top that reads, "hey ladies," in a color gradient of the lesbian pride flag.</p><p>Many of the videos are critiques of a phenomenon called "<a href="https://www.teenvogue.com/story/rainbow-capitalism-fashion-beauty-pride-month" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">rainbow capitalism</a>," the notion <a href="https://www.vox.com/2018/6/25/17476850/pride-month-lgbtq-corporate-explained" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">that corporations earn both money and social capital</a> from selling LGBTQ-themed merchandise.</p><p>"I'm gonna show you guys some of Target's Pride collection. Don't get your hopes up, it like lowkey sucks," TikTok user <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@sfram1218?is_copy_url=1&amp;is_from_webapp=v1p=v1">@sfram1218</a>, who frequently <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@sfram1218/video/6955578849778289926?is_copy_url=0&amp;is_from_webapp=v1&amp;sender_device=pc&amp;sender_web_id=6891259809896056326809896056326">posts videos about being a lesbian</a>, <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@sfram1218/video/6957365642550955269?is_copy_url=0&amp;is_from_webapp=v1&amp;sender_device=pc&amp;sender_web_id=6891259809896056326809896056326">said in the intro to one of her several videos dissecting the items in the collection.</a> </p><blockquote class="tiktok-embed" cite="https://www.tiktok.com/@sfram1218/video/6957365642550955269" data-video-id="6957365642550955269" style="max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px;"> <section> <a target="_blank" title="@sfram1218" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@sfram1218">@sfram1218</a> <p><a title="greenscreen" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/greenscreen">##greenscreen</a> <a title="targetpride" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/targetpride">##targetpride</a> <a title="lgbtq" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/lgbtq">##lgbtq</a> <a title="queer" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/queer">##queer</a> <a title="lgbt" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/lgbt">##lgbt</a> <a title="lesbian" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/lesbian">##lesbian</a> <a title="gay" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/gay">##gay</a> <a title="pridemonth" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/pridemonth">##pridemonth</a> <a title="️‍" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/%F0%9F%8F%B3%EF%B8%8F%E2%80%8D%F0%9F%8C%88">##️‍</a> <a title="shadowandbone" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/shadowandbone">##ShadowAndBone</a> <a title="skiptherinse" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/skiptherinse">##SkipTheRinse</a></p> <a target="_blank" title="♬ Kiss Me More (feat. SZA) - Doja Cat" href="https://www.tiktok.com/music/Kiss-Me-More-feat-SZA-6948086714175621121">♬ Kiss Me More (feat. SZA) - Doja Cat</a> </section> </blockquote> <blockquote class="tiktok-embed" cite="https://www.tiktok.com/@trashbuns/video/6956791484305673477" data-video-id="6956791484305673477" style="max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px;"> <section> <a target="_blank" title="@trashbuns" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@trashbuns">@trashbuns</a> <p>rating targets <a title="pride" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/pride">#pride</a> collection <a title="lgbt" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/lgbt">#lgbt</a> <a title="queer" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/queer">#queer</a> <a title="pridemonth" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/pridemonth">#pridemonth</a> <a title="target" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/target">#target</a> <a title="shopping" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/shopping">#shopping</a> ️‍</p> <a target="_blank" title="♬ Monkeys Spinning Monkeys - Kevin MacLeod" href="https://www.tiktok.com/music/Monkeys-Spinning-Monkeys-6746993352891189249">♬ Monkeys Spinning Monkeys - Kevin MacLeod</a> </section> </blockquote> <blockquote class="tiktok-embed" cite="https://www.tiktok.com/@ylracbutler/video/6957131240289864966" data-video-id="6957131240289864966" style="max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px;"> <section> <a target="_blank" title="@ylracbutler" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@ylracbutler">@ylracbutler</a> <p>besties i’m scared...... <a title="target" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/target">##target</a> <a title="pride" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/pride">##pride</a></p> <a target="_blank" title="♬ Main Titles - Danny Elfman" href="https://www.tiktok.com/music/Main-Titles-5000000000339148811">♬ Main Titles - Danny Elfman</a> </section> </blockquote> <p>Many of the videos rating Pride collections focus on Target's offerings, which the brand rolls out annually. The company's <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/reviews/out?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.target.com%2Fc%2Fpride%2F-%2FN-5589f">Pride collection website page currently lists nearly 250 items</a>.</p><p>Some critics focused on the aesthetics of the collection. One user, <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@dinonuggets.jpg/video/6957961051178683654?is_copy_url=0&amp;is_from_webapp=v1&amp;sender_device=pc&amp;sender_web_id=6891259809896056326809896056326">@dinonuggets.jpg, called a striped rainbow button-down</a> "so ugly it stops being gay and swings around to being aggressively heterosexual."</p><p>Several users have also critiqued a shirt that has multiple sets of pronouns on it, which is <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/reviews/out?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.target.com%2Fp%2Fpride-gender-inclusive-adult-pronouns-short-sleeve-graphic-t-shirt-white%2F-%2FA-81831484%3Fpreselect%3D81623929%23lnk%3Dsametab">listed on the Target website as a "Pride Gender Inclusive Adult 'Pronouns' Short Sleeve Graphic T-Shirt."</a> Though many people use <a href="https://time.com/4327915/gender-neutral-pronouns/">multiple sets of pronouns</a>, the shirt - which includes she/her, he/him, and they/them pronouns - doesn't seem intended to be a declaration of the wearer's pronouns. </p><p>"I understand what they were going for here and that's cool, but I feel like this is an invitation for 'allies' to misgender you on accident," TikTok user <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@calebbbro/video/6957085176081960198?is_copy_url=0&amp;is_from_webapp=v1&amp;sender_device=pc&amp;sender_web_id=6891259809896056326809896056326">@calebbbro said about the shirt in a video.</a></p><blockquote class="tiktok-embed" cite="https://www.tiktok.com/@calebbbro/video/6957085176081960198" data-video-id="6957085176081960198" style="max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px;"> <section> <a target="_blank" title="@calebbbro" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@calebbbro">@calebbbro</a> <p>"I think the ugly things deserve more recognition" <a title="fyp" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/fyp">#fyp</a> <a title="targetpridecollection" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/targetpridecollection">#targetpridecollection</a> <a title="lgbt" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/lgbt">#lgbt</a> <a title="queer" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/queer">#queer</a> <a title="gay" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/gay">#gay</a> <a title="pride2021" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/pride2021">#pride2021</a> <a title="target" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/target">#target</a> <a title="greenscreen" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/greenscreen">#greenscreen</a></p> <a target="_blank" title="♬ Monkeys Spinning Monkeys - Kevin MacLeod" href="https://www.tiktok.com/music/Monkeys-Spinning-Monkeys-6746993352891189249">♬ Monkeys Spinning Monkeys - Kevin MacLeod</a> </section> </blockquote> <p>Target said in a <a href="https://corporate.target.com/article/2020/06/pride">2020 news post on its website</a> that the Pride collection was developed by its merchandising team in conjunction with the company's Pride+ Business Council. In the same post, Target said that it had donated $100,000 to <a href="https://www.glsen.org/our-work">GLSEN</a>, an organization that works to ensure supportive, safe experiences for LGBTQ students, in honor of Pride 2020. The company said it <a href="https://corporate.target.com/article/2019/06/pride">also did so in 2019.</a></p><p>TikTok users have also brought other companies' Pride collections into the fold, including merchandise shown on Hot Topic and Walmart's websites.</p><blockquote class="tiktok-embed" cite="https://www.tiktok.com/@thepigwithwings/video/6957770434251148550" data-video-id="6957770434251148550" style="max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px;"> <section> <a target="_blank" title="@thepigwithwings" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@thepigwithwings">@thepigwithwings</a> <p>fyp <a title="greenscreen" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/greenscreen">#greenscreen</a> <a title="pride" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/pride">#pride</a> <a title="targetpride" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/targetpride">#targetpride</a> <a title="hottopic" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/hottopic">#hottopic</a> <a title="pridemonth" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/pridemonth">#pridemonth</a> <a title="chipsgottalent" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/chipsgottalent">#ChipsGotTalent</a></p> <a target="_blank" title="♬ blurred lines - this is my audio account" href="https://www.tiktok.com/music/blurred-lines-6935656201476754181">♬ blurred lines - this is my audio account</a> </section> </blockquote> <blockquote class="tiktok-embed" cite="https://www.tiktok.com/@parisezeleny/video/6958101197337283846" data-video-id="6958101197337283846" style="max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px;"> <section> <a target="_blank" title="@parisezeleny" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@parisezeleny">@parisezeleny</a> <p>rainbow capitalism <a title="chipsgottalent" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/chipsgottalent">#ChipsGotTalent</a> <a title="pride" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/pride">#pride</a> <a title="walmart" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/walmart">#walmart</a> <a title="gay" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/gay">#gay</a> <a title="pridecollection" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/pridecollection">#pridecollection</a> <a title="walmartpride" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/walmartpride">#walmartpride</a></p> <a target="_blank" title="♬ Kiss Me More (feat. SZA) - Doja Cat" href="https://www.tiktok.com/music/Kiss-Me-More-feat-SZA-6948086714175621121">♬ Kiss Me More (feat. SZA) - Doja Cat</a> </section> </blockquote> <p>The notion of Pride being a "branded holiday," <a href="https://www.vox.com/2018/6/25/17476850/pride-month-lgbtq-corporate-explained">as Vox Senior Correspondent Alex Abad-Santos reported on in 2018,</a> isn't new. As support for LGBTQ people continues to grow, so too does the incentive for corporations and brands to publicly brand themselves as supportive of the community - regardless of the actions that they're taking behind the scenes to actually support LGBTQ people.</p><p>Even when money does go to LGBTQ organizations through Pride month merchandise or campaigns, Abad-Santos wrote, this branding can foster a <keyword id="24504" type="ORGANIZATION" weightage="100" keywordseo="culture">culture</keyword> of "slacktivisim," where companies - and consumers - can show support without necessarily make their own tangible impact.</p><p>Target did not immediately respond to Insider's request for comment. </p>

TikTok users are roasting Pride Month merchandise from giant corporations, targeting 'rainbow capitalism'

<ul class="summary-list"><li>The "<keyword id="13636577" type="UNKNOWN" weightage="60" keywordseo="cool-aunt" source="Orion">cool aunt</keyword>" has emerged as an aspirational identity for young women.</li><li>As more women push off motherhood, aunthood promises both independence and <keyword id="11909916" type="UNKNOWN" weightage="60" keywordseo="family" source="Orion">family</keyword> ties.</li></ul><p>Elaine Welteroth's Instagram is, by design, goals.</p><p>A quick scroll shows the author, "Project Runway" judge, and former Teen Vogue editor in chief living an aspirational life: colorful outfits, impeccable makeup, a beautiful home, vacations with her husband, red-carpet appearances, and, on occasion, cuddles with a niece or nephew. </p><p>"AuntieE now available for babysitting duties! Send me your kids," reads the caption of <a href="https://www.instagram.com/reel/CRrMtOnhB9C/">one reel showing Welteroth smiling ear-to-ear in a bright blue jumpsuit, holding the hands of a baby and dancing to Eve's "Who's That Girl?"</a> </p><blockquote class="instagram-media" style="background:#FFF; border:0; border-radius:3px; box-shadow:0 0 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.5),0 1px 10px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.15); margin: 1px; max-width:540; padding:0; width:99.375%; width:-webkit-calc(100% - 2px); width:calc(100% - 2px); data.width~540;"><div style="padding:8px;"><div style="background:#F8F8F8; line-height:0; margin-top:40px; padding:62.4537037037% 0; text-align:center; width:100%;"><div style="background:url(data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAACwAAAAsCAMAAAApWqozAAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAAAFzUkdCAK7OHOkAAAAMUExURczMzPf399fX1+bm5mzY9AMAAADiSURBVDjLvZXbEsMgCES5/P8/t9FuRVCRmU73JWlzosgSIIZURCjo/ad+EQJJB4Hv8BFt+IDpQoCx1wjOSBFhh2XssxEIYn3ulI/6MNReE07UIWJEv8UEOWDS88LY97kqyTliJKKtuYBbruAyVh5wOHiXmpi5we58Ek028czwyuQdLKPG1Bkb4NnM+VeAnfHqn1k4+GPT6uGQcvu2h2OVuIf/gWUFyy8OWEpdyZSa3aVCqpVoVvzZZ2VTnn2wU8qzVjDDetO90GSy9mVLqtgYSy231MxrY6I2gGqjrTY0L8fxCxfCBbhWrsYYAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC); display:block; height:44px; margin:0 auto -44px; position:relative; top:-22px; width:44px;"></div></div><p style="margin:8px 0 0 0; padding:0 4px;"><a href="https://www.instagram.com/p/CRrMtOnhB9C" style=" color:#000; font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; line-height:17px; text-decoration:none; word-wrap:break-word;" target="_blank"></a></p> <p style=" color:#c9c8cd; font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; line-height:17px; margin-bottom:0; margin-top:8px; overflow:hidden; padding:8px 0 7px; text-align:center; text-overflow:ellipsis; white-space:nowrap;">A post shared by Elaine Welteroth (@elainewelteroth)<time style=" font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; line-height:17px;" datetime=""></time></p></div></blockquote><p>This is the life of #AuntieE, as Welteroth has dubbed herself for years — a woman who is stylish, well-traveled, career-oriented, and has money to spend on <keyword id="6354493" type="UNKNOWN" weightage="60" keywordseo="children" source="Orion">children</keyword> who aren't her own.</p><p>Welteroth is pregnant now, but her #AuntieE persona symbolizes the life that more young women are aspiring to in today's <keyword id="11893570" type="UNKNOWN" weightage="100" keywordseo="economy" source="Orion">economy</keyword>: the cool <keyword id="12798951" type="UNKNOWN" weightage="60" keywordseo="aunt" source="Orion">aunt</keyword>.</p><p>"I'll probably never be a mom. You know what I will be tho...," reads the text in <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@peytondkleinn/video/6959346512891530501?is_copy_url=1&amp;is_from_webapp=v1&amp;q=%23coolaunt&amp;t=1650055998666">a video by TikTok user @peytondstyles</a>. "The cool, single, rich aunt who doesn't look a day over 20 and has a second house in Italy."</p><blockquote class="tiktok-embed" cite="https://www.tiktok.com/@peytondkleinn/video/6959346512891530501" data-video-id="6959346512891530501" style="max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px;"> <section> <a target="_blank" title="@peytondkleinn" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@peytondkleinn">@peytondkleinn</a> my dream <a title="fyp" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/fyp">#fyp</a> <a title="foryou" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/foryou">#foryou</a> <a title="makemomepic" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/makemomepic">#MakeMomEpic</a> #milf <a title="coolaunt" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/coolaunt">#coolaunt</a> <a title="italy" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/italy">#italy</a> <a target="_blank" title="♬ Main Titles (Charlie and the Chocolate Factory) - Danny Elfman" href="https://www.tiktok.com/music/Main-Titles-Charlie-and-the-Chocolate-Factory-5000000000339148811">♬ Main Titles (Charlie and the Chocolate Factory) - Danny Elfman</a> </section> </blockquote> <p>Another user, <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@kelseywilliams60/video/7022010457020026118?is_copy_url=1&amp;is_from_webapp=v1&amp;lang=en">@kelseywilliams60, posted a video</a> of herself holding a baby as text scrawls across the screen: "When everyone asks if you're <keyword id="12213063" type="UNKNOWN" weightage="60" keywordseo="having-kids" source="Orion">having kids</keyword>, but you're the cool aunt." It's clearly a sentiment shared by other TikTok users — #coolaunt has 142.9 million views on the platform.</p><p>The appeal of the "PANK" life is stronger than ever. Short for "professional aunt, no kids," the term was first coined by Melanie Notkin in 2008 to describe affluent, childless women. Now, the aunt persona is an increasingly popular identity for many women in their 20s and 30s, as the stigma of a childless life has turned into a popular movement to be child-free.</p><p>Economics play a role in why many women are choosing a child-free life: Some want to <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/pandemic-baby-bust-could-slow-down-economy-millennials-delaying-kids-2021-4">build wealth first</a>; some think they'll <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/kids-expensive-americans-having-fewer-2018-7">never be able to afford kids</a>; and others are <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/us-birth-fertility-rate-decline-having-baby-millennials-kids-cost-2021-6">seizing opportunities that didn't exist for women 50 years ago</a>. Plus, there are the devastating effects of the climate crisis to worry about. Whatever the reason, many women would rather shower their nieces and nephews with love and attention — before giving them back to their parents at the end of the day.</p><h2><strong>Aunthood over motherhood means more sleep and a clean home</strong></h2><p>"Auntie," the term that Welteroth uses, is used colloquially in Black and Indian communities and generally refers to a woman older than the speaker. It's a <a href="https://www.chicagotribune.com/columns/dahleen-glanton/ct-dahleen-glanton-auntie-maxine-waters-20190620-w3j7p7lwh5bizcacmw3lpwl7ra-story.html">much-debated</a> identifier — some view it as a term of endearment or respect; others find it <a href="https://www.bitchmedia.org/article/some-us-are-brave-agony-auntie">ageist and sexist</a>. Oprah Winfrey, Gayle King, and Ava DuVernay have all reportedly <a href="https://newsletters.theatlantic.com/unsettled-territory/624dc597c42c790021169148/auntie-word-ageism-black-women/">rejected</a> the term, unless it's coming from an actual niece or nephew. </p><p>But women of all races <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIqS1bARw9A">have appropriated</a> the term. They're calling themselves "auntie" on social media, blurring its meaning and origin as part of a movement to claim a child-free identity. On TikTok, videos tagged #auntielife have 62 million views; #auntie videos have 988 million views. Most of these women — Gen Z and millennials who aspire to a clean home, disposable income, ample travel, and a carefree status in the lives of their nieces and nephews — could go by simply "aunt." After all, that tag is no less popular, with 856 million views.</p><p>It hasn't always been so aspirational. Patty Sotirin, a professor of communications at Michigan Tech explores aunt life as an alternate path of womanhood in contemporary society in her book, "<a href="https://www.amazon.com/Where-Aunts-Are-Feminism-Kinship/dp/1602583307">Where the Aunts Are: Family, Feminism, and Kinship in Popular Culture.</a>"</p><p>Since the book's debut in 2013, the appeal of "aunting" has become even stronger as more women delay having children or decide not to have them at all, Sotirin told Insider. "These people have a sense that the only way to have a family is to be an aunt," she said. "They value the auntie role and the auntie possibility."</p><blockquote class="tiktok-embed" cite="https://www.tiktok.com/@wreckitren98/video/6949149885757148422" data-video-id="6949149885757148422" style="max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px;"> <section> <a target="_blank" title="@wreckitren98" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@wreckitren98">@wreckitren98</a> <a title="auntielife" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/auntielife">#auntielife</a> <a title="hotaunt" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/hotaunt">#hotaunt</a> <a target="_blank" title="♬ Bongo cha-cha-cha - Remastered - Caterina Valente" href="https://www.tiktok.com/music/Bongo-cha-cha-cha-Remastered-6927076140512135170">♬ Bongo cha-cha-cha - Remastered - Caterina Valente</a> </section> </blockquote> <p>Sotirin said that as aunting grows more appealing, the role has become commercialized, making it even more popular. It explains the growing depiction of the affluent, cool aunt as someone who can shower their nieces and nephews in gifts, with aunt-labeled merchandise, such as <a href="https://www.zazzle.com/worlds_best_ever_aunt_auntie_definition_tote_bag-149634783916589381?rf=238778069823835601&amp;tc=Cj0KCQjwjN-SBhCkARIsACsrBz5E-xILG1tS69SChrDaqtCIaQxuaDHrgd6EcnFmsfi4uoB-_T-kc1MaAnLoEALw_wcB&amp;utm_source=google&amp;utm_medium=cpc&amp;utm_campaign=us_shopping&amp;utm_term=z149634783916589381&amp;ca_chid=2001810&amp;ca_source=gaw&amp;ca_ace=&amp;ca_nw=g&amp;ca_dev=c&amp;ca_pl=&amp;ca_pos=&amp;ca_cid=575898871896&amp;ca_agid=127359958490&amp;ca_caid=15870387743&amp;ca_adid=575898871896&amp;ca_kwt=&amp;ca_mt=&amp;ca_fid=&amp;ca_tid=pla-1479534378716&amp;ca_lp=9060351&amp;ca_li=&amp;ca_devm=&amp;ca_plt=&amp;gclsrc=aw.ds&amp;gclid=Cj0KCQjwjN-SBhCkARIsACsrBz5E-xILG1tS69SChrDaqtCIaQxuaDHrgd6EcnFmsfi4uoB-_T-kc1MaAnLoEALw_wcB">"Auntie" tote bags</a> or <a href="https://www.etsy.com/listing/1162023502/cool-aunt-sweatshirt-gift-for-best?gpla=1&amp;gao=1&amp;&amp;utm_source=google&amp;utm_medium=cpc&amp;utm_campaign=shopping_us_d-clothing-unisex_adult_clothing-hoodies_and_sweatshirts-other&amp;utm_custom1=_k_Cj0KCQjwjN-SBhCkARIsACsrBz66oNK9NA3Be8ljcV9EBQJkquuIev7WxP7gtoZCuALARlpKVW_nzjoaAmdvEALw_wcB_k_&amp;utm_content=go_12569400664_123239936327_507343473114_pla-323914158697_c__1162023502_530199033&amp;utm_custom2=12569400664&amp;gclid=Cj0KCQjwjN-SBhCkARIsACsrBz66oNK9NA3Be8ljcV9EBQJkquuIev7WxP7gtoZCuALARlpKVW_nzjoaAmdvEALw_wcB">"Cool Aunt" sweatshirt</a>s, popping up to accommodate the trend. </p><p>It's a business move borne from a demographic shift. The birth rate in the US has been falling <a href="https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/vsrr/vsrr-007-508.pdf">since 2008</a> as women have postponed having kids until later in life, falling in line with worldwide trends. From 2019 to 2020, the US birth rate <a href="https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/vsrr/vsrr012-508.pdf">fell by 4%</a>, the sharpest single-year decline in nearly 50 years and the lowest number of births since 1979. </p><p>While many of the <a href="http://savvyauntie.com/Customimages/GENERATION%20PANK_MELANIE%20NOTKIN%20MEDIA%20INC_Nov%202018.pdf">18.4 million PANKs</a> in the 20-to-50 age range in the US want to be mothers but can't have children or haven't found themselves in the right situation, other child-free women have taken steps to stay that way. After all, childcare costs run <a href="https://info.childcareaware.org/hubfs/FINAL-Demanding%20Change%20Report-020322.pdf?utm_campaign=Budget%20Reconciliation%20Fall%202021&amp;utm_source=website&amp;utm_content=22_demandingchange_pdf">$10,000 a year</a> on average, a pandemic continues to persist, and women of childbearing age still <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/pandemic-baby-bust-could-slow-down-economy-millennials-delaying-kids-2021-4">struggle to gain a financial footing</a>,</p><p>There's also the cohort who simply aren't interested in having children, regardless of economic circumstances. More than half of respondents in a <a href="https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2021/11/19/growing-share-of-childless-adults-in-u-s-dont-expect-to-ever-have-children/">recent Pew survey</a> said it's "not too likely" or "not at all likely " that they'll have children, citing the reason as they "just don't want to have children." Several women who fall into this camp <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/women-dont-want-kids-birth-rate-love-fulfilling-life-2022-4">recently told Insider</a> they love their life the way it is and want the freedom to to pursue their passions and have time for themselves. </p><p>Being an aunt gives those who can't afford kids a sense of kinship, and those who aren't interested in raising kids the best of both worlds: independence and family.</p><blockquote class="tiktok-embed" cite="https://www.tiktok.com/@kelseywilliams60/video/7022010457020026118" data-video-id="7022010457020026118" style="max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px;"> <section> <a target="_blank" title="@kelseywilliams60" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@kelseywilliams60">@kelseywilliams60</a> Holidays are coming up so we getting ready for this famous question <a title="aunt" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/aunt">#aunt</a> <a title="auntielife" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/auntielife">#auntielife</a> <a title="boyaunt" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/boyaunt">#boyaunt</a> <a title="fy" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/fy">#fy</a> <a title="fyp" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/fyp">#fyp</a> <a title="foryou" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/foryou">#foryou</a> <a title="foryourpage" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/foryourpage">#foryourpage</a> <a title="love" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/love">#love</a> <a title="toocute" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/toocute">#toocute</a> <a title="single" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/single">#single</a> <a target="_blank" title="♬ original sound - TeeMoneyyyyy93" href="https://www.tiktok.com/music/original-sound-6976110406569888517">♬ original sound - TeeMoneyyyyy93</a> </section> </blockquote> <p>"Kids are expensive and sticky, and I would rather be the fun aunt that does crafts with them and has a beautiful home that doesn't have to be child-proofed," Taylor Schenker, 25, told Insider of her choice to not have children.</p><p>As TikTok user @wreckitwren98, whose bio reads "my favorite people call me Aunt Ren," <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@wreckitren98/video/6949149885757148422?is_copy_url=1&amp;is_from_webapp=v1&amp;q=%23auntielife&amp;t=1649887392508">points out in a video</a>, "Being an auntie has all the benefits of being a mom … and then I get to give them back and sleep for eight hours."</p><h2><strong>A new kind of role model</strong></h2><p>Part of the allure of aunthood is the sense that it offers a chance to be creative with your identity, Sotirin said.</p><p>"The aunt becomes who she develops herself as, who she performs as," she said. "You can be the loving aunt who shows up with presents all the time, or you can be an aunt who feels just like a mother."</p><p>The more fluid connection between aunt and child is exactly what appeals to 35-year-old Haylie Swenson.</p><p>"There's freedom in that looseness, and I don't just mean the freedom to sleep as long as I want (which I also enjoy)," she told Insider in an email. "Even the best parent-kid relationships have baggage, and I don't have that with my nieces and nephews. I don't have to do anything to teach them how to be people in a constantly changing, terrifying world. I get to just love them, be myself, and let them be themselves in turn."</p><p>Being an aunt also doesn't have to be defined by blood. Sotirin said there are a lot of "chosen families" these days, a concept <a href="https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/chosen-families-ruptured-how-covid-19-hit-lgbtq-lifeline-n1251849">made popular by queer people</a> who may have rocky relationships with their biological families. Seeing examples of this allows children to envision other life opportunities. </p><blockquote class="tiktok-embed" cite="https://www.tiktok.com/@hannah.montoya/video/6944072101783506182" data-video-id="6944072101783506182" style="max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px;"> <section> <a target="_blank" title="@hannah.montoya" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@hannah.montoya">@hannah.montoya</a> my life goal <a title="pov" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/pov">#pov</a> <a title="comedy" target="_blank" href="https://www.tiktok.com/tag/comedy">#comedy</a> <a target="_blank" title="♬ Deceptacon - Thisisnotarlynn" href="https://www.tiktok.com/music/Deceptacon-6927870252407622406">♬ Deceptacon - Thisisnotarlynn</a> </section> </blockquote> <p>"It may be the single, cool aunt who has a career instead of children," Sotirin said. "Or it could be the chosen aunt who takes you out for dinner and talks to you like an adult. There are lots of ways that aunts give us other kinds of possibilities about what women can do and who women can be that's not their mother."</p><p>Aunts can serve as both role models and resources for the family, she added.</p><p>That's how Jennifer Lake, 35, views her aunt role. She told Insider that being child-free by choice gives her and her husband more time to spend with her niece.</p><p>"I hope to be an added support system that steps in to help, run errands, do laundry, babysit, and just show up for family and our niece in the good and the tough times," she said. "I look forward to being a go-to resource for our niece when she grows older and wants advice or just to chat through things she's going through in life."</p>

More and more women just want to be 'the cool aunt' instead of having their own kids

<p></p><div class="KonaFilter image-container display-table"><div><div class="image on-image"><img src="https://static-ssl.businessinsider.com/image/5c891dfc401d5812095aefe7-1200/pinar%20toprak%20jesse%20grant%20getty.jpg" border="0" alt="Pinar Toprak Jesse Grant Getty" data-mce-source="Jesse Grant/Getty"><p class="source"><span>Jesse Grant/Getty</span></p><p class="caption">"Captain Marvel" composer Pinar Toprak.</p></img></div><p></p></div></div><ul class="summary-list"><li>Pinar Toprak became the first female composer of a Marvel movie with the release of "Captain Marvel."</li><li>Her journey to that achievement is an inspiring one.</li><li>Toprak talked to Business Insider about coming to America knowing little English at 17, becoming a music composer, and her stops working with David Ellison, Danny Elfman, and "Fortnite" along the way.</li></ul><p>&#xa0;</p><p>Pinar Toprak realized very early on what she wanted to do with her life, and it was making music for movies.&#xa0;</p><p>She was so obsessed with movie scores as a kid back in Istanbul, Turkey in the 1980s that she would look in the local paper to find when a favorite movie of hers was playing on TV, then take her Walkman and place it next to the TV so she could record the movie's score.&#xa0;</p><p>It wasn't until later in life she learned you could buy movie soundtracks.&#xa0;</p><p>But it's a perfect example of Toprak going the extra mile to get what she wanted. And getting the composer job on "Captain Marvel," making her to first woman to have that credit on a Marvel movie, was no different. In fact, Toprak's journey to the coveted job has a little Carol Danvers in it, as most of her career, she's been fighting to do things she's been told aren't right for her.</p><h2>Taking her own path</h2><p>At age 17, knowing very little English, Toprak moved to the US to get into college and continue to study music. For the first year she lived with her brother in Chicago, and soon after was accepted to Berklee College of Music in Boston - but not to study film scoring.</p><p>Though she wanted to become a film composer, her family and friends pushed her away from doing it.</p><p>"Everyone was telling me that film scoring wasn't the wisest route for a degree because being a Turkish woman there just aren't any people like me doing it," Toprak told Business Insider. "I really doubted myself, so when I first got to Berklee I was a piano performance major."</p><p>But quickly Toprak realized she wasn't happy. And the more she would go to movies and hear the music in them, she couldn't hold back her dream of doing the same thing. She changed her major to film scoring.</p><p><em><strong>Read more</strong></em>: <em><a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/captain-marvel-directors-interview-nothing-but-love-for-the-trolls-2019-3">"Captain Marvel" directors on why they have nothing but love for the internet trolls, and how being falsely linked to another Marvel movie might have gotten them the job</a></em></p><p>"They fooled me for a second," Toprak said with a laugh. "But I wanted to just go on my own path."</p><p>In 2000, Toprak moved out to Los Angeles and began studying at Cal State Northridge in a master's program for classical composition. She got her first taste of the business when she was selected to intern at Paramount's music department. There she would sit in on the classical arrangements for shows done on the lot, like "Star Trek: Enterprise" and "JAG." She was also making demos back home and sending them out to anyone in the business who would take them. This led to her getting on the radar of David Ellison, son of Oracle CTO Larry Ellison and now founder and CEO of Skydance <keyword id="6354777" type="COMPANY" weightage="60" keywordseo="Media">Media</keyword>.</p><p>At the time, Ellison was like Toprak: just someone trying to get into movies. He hired Toprak to score his 2005 short film, "When All Else Fails," marking Toprak's first big film job.</p><p>"It took a while to realize who he actually is," Toprak said of working with Ellison. "We started a friendship and I have worked with him on a few things since. I actually scored the music for his Skydance logo."</p><p>&#xa0;</p><p>As the years passed, Toprak continued to hustle. She got a programming position at composer Hans Zimmer's studio, did the score for a video game that led to her landing an agent, and did the scores for indie movies. She also continued to send out her work.</p><p>"There was a time I turned my living room into an assembly line," she said. "This was before YouTube and SoundCloud, so I would print CDs, resumes, and cover letters to individual filmmakers. I'm sure some of them were just tossed in the trash, but I did get some films out of it and the word of mouth would lead me to another job."</p><p>And it was also good to have the same agent as legendary composer Danny Elfman. That connection got her the opportunity to come in and demo for him, leading to her working alongside him on 2017's "Justice League" providing additional music for the movie.</p><p>Around the same time, she got the job to compose the score for a little game you may have heard of: "Fortnite: Save the World."</p><p>Toprak was gaining momentum, but her next goal came to her when she saw news break in the trades that Marvel Studios would make a "Captain Marvel" movie.</p><h2>Owning the moment</h2><p>"I made my intentions very clear to my agent that I should get a shot at this," Toprak said of being considered to score "Captain Marvel."</p><p>Though she wanted the job, she also wanted to at least get in the room and show the Marvel Studio executives her talent with the hope of being considered in the future.</p><p>She finally got her shot in April last year and didn't waste the moment.</p><p>Unlike the old days when she would mail a CD and resume, Toprak went big for Marvel. She wrote multiple pieces of music for the demo and hired a 70-piece orchestra to perform it. Toprak then did a video shoot of her conducting the orchestra. Toprak said the musicians had no idea it was a demo for "Captain Marvel."</p><p>&#xa0;</p><p>"The music was titled 'demo one' and 'demo two,' so nobody knew," she said.</p><p>Toprak also recorded another video of her inside her studio speaking to the camera about why doing the movie would be important to her. And she played some arrangements on her piano.</p><p>Toprak said she went to these lengths to prove to Marvel that the moment wouldn't be too big for her.</p><p>"I have no idea to this day how many people were considered, but I wanted to make sure that they had a sense of who I am and how important this is to me," she said.</p><p>A month later, Toprak got word that she would be the composer for "Captain Marvel" and spent five months working on the music, recording close to 100 minutes of score.</p><p><em><strong>Read more</strong></em>: <em><a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/captain-marvel-editor-interview-ronan-marvel-studios-secret-cameo-2019-3">"Captain Marvel" editor describes what makes Marvel Studios a unique place to work, and the funny way she got the job</a></em></p><p>Toprak said the mix of orchestra and electronic pieces throughout the movie came through the discussions with the movie's directors, <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/captain-marvel-directors-interview-nothing-but-love-for-the-trolls-2019-3">Anna Boden and Ryan Fleck</a>.</p><p>"We felt the hybrid approach was really appropriate given that Carol Danvers herself is a hybrid," Toprak said. "So when we have the cosmic scenes and wanted to create a certain vibe we have one style, and we wanted to create a certain vibe when you're on Earth."</p><p>A big part of the Earth scenes is the use of songs from the 1990s, the period in which the movie is set. Toprak said she was aware of the choice, since she sat in the meetings and knew which scenes had song placements and which needed an original score. Toprak was not disappointed that the movie would have a lot of needle drops.</p><p>&#xa0;</p><p>"I never put my ego in the way, it's about making the best film," she said. "Sometimes a really cool song goes a long way in telling the story."</p><p>That said, seeing the DNA of arrangements she created for the demo, like "<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-4jocTOqeg" target="_blank" rel="noopener">Breaking Free,</a>" last through her months of work and end up in the final movie was also really cool, she said.</p><p>Since "Captain Marvel" had one of the biggest opening weekends ever for a superhero movie, Toprak said it's like she's been living in a parallel universe. She's not just the first female composer on a Marvel movie, but now the highest-grossing female film composer ever.</p><p>"Any time you work towards something your whole life and people can recognize it, that's a great thing regardless of your gender or anything else," she said. "But from the days where I begged people to listen to my music to now, it's been an incredible journey."</p><p><em>"Captain Marvel" is currently playing in theaters.</em></p><div>    <iframe src="//instagram.com/p/Bm38eK4g2ep/embed/" width="540" height="auto" frameborder="0" scrolling="no" allowtransparency="true">    </iframe></div><div>    <iframe src="//instagram.com/p/Buzct6oFTDW/embed/" width="540" height="auto" frameborder="0" scrolling="no" allowtransparency="true">    </iframe></div><div>    <iframe src="//instagram.com/p/BunvBAYFdxQ/embed/" width="540" height="auto" frameborder="0" scrolling="no" allowtransparency="true">    </iframe></div>    <div class="margin-top">        <h3>NOW WATCH: <a href="https://www.businessinsider.com/spiderman-spider-man-into-spider-verse-animated-frame-rate-marvel-stan-lee-2019-2">How Oscar-winning 'Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse' changed comic book movies forever</a></h3>        <div>            <iframe class="bijwplayerclass" data-player="jwplayer" src="https://content.jwplatform.com/players/9htbBxZx-CEZHWCBG.html" width="100%" height="100%" frameborder="0" scrolling="auto" style="margin:0px;" allowfullscreen=""></iframe><script>function receiveMessage(event){ console.log(event.data.fullscreen); Android.fullscreen(event.data.fullscreen); }window.addEventListener("message", receiveMessage, false);</script>        </div>    </div>

Inside the inspiring journey of 'Captain Marvel' composer Pinar Toprak, from moving to America at 17 to becoming the first female composer of a Marvel movie

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